Accurascale Wagon Packs

[RailwayRobbo]

Accurascale have just released a couple of wagons that have taken my fancy. A 21 ton steel mineral wagons in grey and bauxite and a steel coil carrying wagon. I only want 1 of each but they only sell all their wagons in packs of 3 at £75. WHY? Their bigger wagons are twin packs and they have a small cauldron wagon in packs of 4.

I noticed Rails have a limited edition 21 ton steel mineral in bauxite from something called 'Jenny Kirk's Monday Club' at £30 but it's got some kind of 'JK' logo on it which doesn't look right.

Pete

[Bigmet]

Think they are aiming to sell trainloads to people that are (train) loaded...

I have a number of 21 tonners in grey mostly from kits, but wouldn't say no to a couple of bauxite 21 tonners in the original BR livery, so if I take the plunge do you want me to get in touch?

[Mountain]

I was just thinking how much one would need to pay out if one wanted an accurate representation of a real train in 00... Around £200 for the loco these days if one wants DCC, and around £1000 for the wagons depending on the train length. It seems odd to me that then it still does not look accurate due to the limitations of the look of the couplings and the gauge width, though to be honest, the gauge inaccuracy is less noticable because if one has spent time in cabs of a DMU or a loco (DMU's usually have better views from the cab), the perspective one sees will be one where the track actually looks narrower then it actually is, but the inaccurate couplings do stand out. The solution would be to make rolling stock that are easy to convert to working prototype couplings (Or bar type couplings which look like prototype couplings) which can have hooks and three link or screw link etc couplings that would just clip into place, and the tension locks clip out (Which the tension locks do these days).


It is quite a price though to make a convincing train length. It never was cheap but...

I do see your point though. One may only want to buy one of the things!

Also, why can't they give a discount on a bundle of 30 wagons in a pack? Why don't they give the option to buy them as complete rakes? When I was into 00 gauge, I would travel far to try to get complete rakes because each shop was only allocated a few wagons... It actually took me over a decade to get a rake of 14 pallet vans in any livery! (I did not mind painting them if needed). I had them on order for many years at one shop, and one day mny years later I happened to call in, and he had delivery of many of them (Enough for me to make a rake) and he did not let me know. Was only by chance I got those.
If manufacturers considered selling in rake packs with wagons all individually numbered I am sure they would sell even if they were not cheap.

But likewize, it is a bit stupid not having the option of buying them one their own in single wagon in a box form because someone somewhere may only need the one!

[Bigmet]

I was just thinking how much one would need to pay out if one wanted an accurate representation of a real train in 00...

It's much less if you do it from a combination of kits and scratch. I reserve my RTR expenditure for items that are difficult to paint, as that's the weakest part of my skill set. (It was great 20 odd years ago when a Bachmann WD 2-8-0 and 60 of their short wheelbase wagons came in at just over £300, but it was pretty obvious this couldn't last!)

[RailwayRobbo]

Think they are aiming to sell trainloads to people that are (train) loaded...

I have a number of 21 tonners in grey mostly from kits, but wouldn't say no to a couple of bauxite 21 tonners in the original BR livery, so if I take the plunge do you want me to get in touch?

Thanks Bigmet.
Yes I'd be up for taking one off your hands if you buy a pack.
I do have a 21 ton in grey which the Model Centre released recently as a limited edition (Bachmann) so a bauxite one would be just right.
Let me know if you take the plunge.

Pete

[Mountain]

I was just thinking how much one would need to pay out if one wanted an accurate representation of a real train in 00...

It's much less if you do it from a combination of kits and scratch. I reserve my RTR expenditure for items that are difficult to paint, as that's the weakest part of my skill set. (It was great 20 odd years ago when a Bachmann WD 2-8-0 and 60 of their short wheelbase wagons came in at just over £300, but it was pretty obvious this couldn't last!)

I think sometimes we underestimate the manual assembling of wagons and other things. We tend to think "Machine" but ok, certain processes make things quicker to mass assemble then a modeller in his own house could do it... But even then it is more then the cost of the materials that go in. Having said that, one still looks at models and the cost of the individual materials and thinks "I could do that for half that price!" (Though maybe not to those standards!)
It is fascinating to see the production processes in action. It makes me think "If they can change this and change that it would be easier" but would it?

One thing though I do think is that modellers have become far to fussy. I do see that it is nice to be fussy, but to me, to capture the feel of the prototype and one is onto a winner. The fact that the prototype has 10 rivets and the model may have 9 or 11 does not mean anything to me. It is pointless even looking! To me I see a row of rivits. That is all I need to see as I am so much larger then the model is and also the models rivits serve no real purpose on the model then looks, so it does not really matter. I would need my reding glasses just to count the things so it is pointless to have such accuracy on my models.
But the angles of the body and the basic feel and look of the model is what I look for.

I have to laugh. I never forget many years ago I was a child when the Jouef class 40 came out. Then one day about 20 years later I saw one secondhand in a shop and bought it. I was in a bit of a hurry as I was inbetween trains, so I did a brief check, and I knew if the guy said it worked, it works as I had bought from him before and he would tell me if it had any issues.
So I brought this model home. I unwrapped it and it sat next to my other models (I think I had bought a new Lima class 40 by then and well. The Jouef was secondhand).
Now I know Jouef were good at the mechanical aspects of the model, but the body shape and size... The dimensions were all over the place. The body was far too wide and too low. It was so out if proportion that I offered it cheap to a friend and he did not have a class 40 so to him the dimensions did not matter too much as he just wanted one example of each class of loco for his collection.
Now I was thinking to myself and I told someone about this as I recall that the model got very good reviews when it came out. The other person said "Who gave the good reviews?" I did not remember, so I looked back in my old magazines and I found out who gave the good reviews. Jouef! I had to laugh! It was hillarious. Though fair play to the company, the model was built to last. I give them that.

[Bigmet]

I have had the pair of bauxite 21 tonners I am retaining on the test track to play with, and very good too. Look right, run well, neatly arranged and firmly attached underside detail, (most of which is invisible on track) which notably doesn't prevent the wheelsets from being easily removed.

The NEM coupler pockets are mounted on swing arms, and in combination with the sprung buffers, makes buffer heads just in grazing contact possible on straight track if a 'rigid bar' type coupler is used, Roco's in my case. (I may fiddle a little with the spacing to maximise the good effect, Accurascale have been a little conservative in not fully exploiting the sprung buffers, and I can get a tad closer on my 30" minimum radius curves.)

And the wheels now. These look very fine, and measurement explains all: 11.8mm tyre diameter, which is worn condition, diameter over flanges 13mm, scale for near new, so the wheels look right size over the flanges, which are about 0.6mm deep. Heljan have been doing this for years on their locos, and it looks so well, glad to see another manufacturer take this up. They run reliably on my test track which is a real mixture of code 100 streamline, and both RTL and kit built code 75 - it's a specifically built test track for what the new layout is going to require and none too carefully laid, to represent 'worst case' results from my dodgy track laying ability.

If I had to criticise it would be the fitting of a tension lock coupler. It's a good miniature tension lock and appears a dimensional match to Bachmann's which suits me very well. BUT, as is well known these don't work well on swinging coupler mounts. Accurascale would do well to drop these and supply the Roco, Fleischmann or some other brand of rigid link type couplers fitted, with the tension locks as an alternative in the box, and a suggestion that if these are used preventing the pocket swinging would be the best plan. (You can wedge a piece of plasticard in to achieve this.)

[Boksonay]

[Admin's edit] this is accurascale's response

If it helps, accurascale offer an automatic 10% bundle discount when you buy two or more packs of wagons (or coaches)

[Bufferstop]

I agree with Mountain's opinion about wagon couplings the gaps have got decidedly wider since the introduction of NEM mounting pockets, the problem being the length of tensionlock couplers compared to the continental horn and loop or KD's. I've taken to cutting off about half the length of the pocket and gluing the couplers in with impact adhesive. It's not a perfect weld, it holds the coupler sufficiently but still allows it to be pulled out with a little extra force. Some of Dapol's wagons seem particularly bad. Even when designing for use on first radius there is no need for the buffering face of the loop to be more than its own thickness in front of the buffer faces.

[Boksonay]

Accurascale's explanation

Our Mk2's couple touching on the straight, and we've included coupling bars or knuckles with many wagon packs (and our Chaldron wagons use a bespoke magnetic chain). Our Mk5 range also feature magnetic dummy delners. The tension lock is (for now) a necessary evil, but it's certainly possible to work around it.

[Bigmet]

...The tension lock is (for now) a necessary evil, but it's certainly possible to work around it...

Get brave and fit whatever your customer base approve as the superior coupler, with the tension locks in the box to accommodate the general market?

Bachmann did this with their HTA's many years ago, and the sales were good by my estimation, so there is successful precedent.

[Boksonay]

As we did with our PTAs and will with the chaldron wagons.
Customers don't want to have to install couplers though, is the feedback we get, even tho on our locos we detail on end and pop the coupler in the other,,, I guess we need to blame triang for using tension locks all those years ago

[Bigmet]

...Customers don't want to have to install couplers though, is the feedback we get...

Well, paint me surprised, considering the market sector you are aiming at!

[Bigmet]

If it helps, accurascale offer an automatic 10% bundle discount when you buy two or more packs of wagons (or coaches)

I will be in for that should you ever offer 4mm models of end vestibule Gresley coach stock